In Con-verse-ation with Gieve

Over the weekend, I attended a poetry workshop facilitated by Gieve Patel at the British Council, Bangalore. It was an absolute pleasure interacting with the poet, painter, playwright and physician- to listen to him marvel at Shakespeare and revel in Seth, and to read out some of my poems to Gieve and a cheering crowd made up of lit and media students, engineering grads and a navigator for the Indian Navy.

Who better to learn the nuances of a craft than from the masters themselves? It is remarkable the kind of insights you can gain by casually chatting with a seasoned practitioner of art. Here I reproduce bits and bursts- in no particular sequence or chronology- of my two daylong conversation with aapro Gieve (pronounced with a G for Gandhi.. "Most people call me Jeev. I like Jeev too.")

Me : When did you first write poetry?

Gieve : I started writing poetry in school. Back then, it was to see my name featured in the school magazine.. that felt good.

Me : I was schooled at St. Xavier's too. (palpable excitement in my voice)

Gieve : We missed each other by a few years!

Me : Few equals fifty! I think the kind of poems we are exposed to in school, and the way poetry is treated vis-à-vis prose lessons governs our interest in the form. I was lucky to have teachers who did not accord step-motherly treatment to poetry! I fondly remember reading your poem 'On Killing a Tree' [read here] in eighth grade and wanting to meet you. When did you write that?

Gieve : I wrote it at 21.

Me : Wow! I thought you'd say you wrote it 21 years back! In the early days, whom did you show your poems to for evaluation? Whom should a young poet turn to for opinions?

Gieve : Show them to someone you respect. I used to show them to my friends. There were times when a person would criticise a piece a lot and I would go into fifteen days of depression. But slowly, I reached a place where if I loved one of my poems, I wouldn't worry if the world hated it.

Me : It would be interesting to know who your favourite poets are..

Gieve : My favourites kept changing with age. In my twenties, I liked the free verse of D. H. Lawrence; Arun Kolatkar and A. K. Ramanujan in the thirties. I read a lot of Wordsworth in my forties, and Shakespeare throughout. Tolstoy and Tagore are two of my favourite writers. I also like Nissim Ezekiel's work.

Me : Nissim Ezekiel published your first collection of poems..

Gieve : Yes. I used to meet him regularly, and one day, when I was 25 he said, 'Gieve, you have a good number of poems now. You should bring out a book.' I was studying at Grant Medical College then. I exclaimed, 'But I have exams coming up!' Ezekiel said with a laugh, 'Oh exams are for life.'

Me : You have been a practising physician all your adult life. How did you juggle your occupation and your art?

Gieve : It was difficult initially. After ten years of practice, I stopped working on Sundays. Gradually, I came to consult only weekday evenings. Mornings were dedicated to painting and poetry.

Me : What prompts you to write poetry?

Gieve : Ignorance about the world leads to art. Through curiosity, an artist tries to learn about the subject by painting it or penning it. He goes from ignorance to knowledge in the process of creating the piece.

Me : Do you compose poetry when the urge strikes you? Or do you spend a considerable amount of time composing each piece?

Gieve : Very rarely do poets compose their poems in one go. You have to chisel and carve it till it reaches a point where it should not be touched any more, lest you spoil it. Mandelstam is the only poet I know of who wrote on impulse, and never revised what he wrote. He would wake up in the morning with the feeling that a poem was coming to him. He would pace around the house and dictate his lines to his wife, saying 'Write so-and-so as the third word of the second line of this stanza!' Such genius is hard to find. I am never happy with my first draft. Often people visiting my place lay their eyes on an unfinished painting and say, 'Just leave it like that! It's perfect! Don't touch it any more.' But of course, I'm going to touch it.. (smiles)

Me : I stay very close to your clinic. (Gieve stays at Colaba, but had a clinic near Bombay Central station.) Do you still have that?

Gieve : No, I've retired. It's been seven years.

Me : How much do you feel has your professional life as a doctor shaped you as an artist?

Gieve : One's experiences do make their way into one's art. For instance, my series of paintings depicting accident victims stemmed from my visits to morgues or accident sites. It was my way of coming to terms with what I saw. I believe encounters with suffering are important to artists.

Me : Poetry, or even writing for that matter is not a lucrative career option. What is your advice to young poets? At what stage in their lives should they try to get their work out in the public domain?

Gieve : It's impoverishing! Poetry is poverty! My advice would be: If you love doing something, continue doing it. Think of what matters to you in life and pursue it. Publication will come from reading and writing for at least five years.

Me : I understand. I want to know your thoughts on whether travelling or learning a new language help in growing as a poet?

Gieve : It all depends on the individual's need. The need arises from within. Once you know what you want to write about, you'll know what you need to write it. Follow your knows.

Me : Haha.. that's a nice way to put it! But would you recommend taking up literature fellowships where someone pays you to work on a book devotedly for a year or two?

Gieve : It wouldn't work for everybody. There was this case of an English poet - I forget his name- he was offered a scholarship to write, and they would sponsor his travel around the world for a year. But he declined the offer, simply because he hated travelling! Of course, it's always good to learn a new language.

Me : What do you think of poetry prizes, and poets who have won awards before? Are awards important?

Gieve : Longevity is the sole deciding factor of the beauty of any art form. Look at the Literature Nobel winners of the 2000s. You don't hear of them even ten years since they were awarded the prize. I'd love to win an award though! (chuckles heartily)

Me : You spoke of the impact that Tolstoy and Tagore had on you. But would you not say getting influenced by other writers curbs one's own originality and style?

Gieve : No! There have been so many great writers over the ages, and have produced works of breathtaking artistry. We must read extensively, absorb and admire the beauty that has preceded us. And one's voice as a writer must not be so feeble as to be gagged by the works you read.

Me : That's true. Which poets then, do you suggest a youngster interested in writing poetry read? Should she read more of Indian poets writing in English, considering she will publish it in the Indian sphere?

Gieve : There is no specific set of poets that you should or should not read. Go by your liking. Pick up an anthology and read through it. Then read more of the poets you like.

Me : Have you read any poetry by some of the younger generation of Indian poets? How did you find them?

Gieve : Frankly, at my age, people tend to spend their time revisiting classics or reading what concerns them. I haven't been able to read much of the younger poets.

Me : Do you think poetry as an art must have an underlying meaning or a motive? Or should it suffice to be emotive?

Gieve : I don't think every poem has a moral or a motive. Many poems are written for the enjoyment of it.

Me : Yes, they are indeed. May I ask what you are working on currently?

Gieve : I recently finished a poem on the legend of Orpheus and Eurydice written from the perspective of Hermes. (He later read this out to thunderous applause.) I'm also trying to translate some Gujarati poets with the help of some of my Gujarati friends.